RE: [thelionscall] Phoenixes, Stags and Aslan
There are numerous reasons the stag may have been a significant symbol to Christians, especially Christians of the middle ages. In ancient times, the stag was considered an enemy of snakes, they wore a “crown” on their heads. And then there’s the legend of St. Eustace (familiar name) who was a Roman officer who came a cross a stag on a hunting trip whose horns formed a cross. Eustace converted to Christianity there and then.
From: thelionscall@yahoogroups.com [mailto:thelionscall@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Kristi Simonson
Sent: Thursday, November 30, 2006 11:17 AM
To: thelionscall@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [thelionscall] Phoenixes, Stags and Aslan
I wasn't aware that a white stag had Christian significance. I know that
white animals are often a marker of passing into another world, such as
fairyland, and white deer in particular, in literature.
Kristi the Fisherdess
"There does not seem to be much chance of their meeting again in that world
or any other. But if ever they do they will rush together with their hands
held out." - The Voyage of the Dawn Treader
>From: "Stanley, Dan" <dstanley@ag.
>Reply-To: thelionscall@
>To: <thelionscall@
>Subject: [thelionscall] Phoenixes, Stags and Aslan
>Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2006 11:01:34 -0600
>
>I have doubts that the white stag was Aslan in Lewis's mind. But
>thinking about that shifts my thinking a bit on the phoenix in the
>garden. The stag is an ancient Christological symbol as well (as John
>Granger emphasizes in his book on the hidden meanings of Harry Potter
>books). Perhaps Lewis just has a tendency to include these symbols in
>his story without them being actually symbolic of anything.
>
>
>
>Blessings,
>
>
>
>Dan
>
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: thelionscall@
>On Behalf Of Kristi Simonson
>Sent: Thursday, November 30, 2006 10:35 AM
>To: thelionscall@
>Subject: Re: [thelionscall] New poll for thelionscall
>
>
>
>Maybe more of an angelic figure then...I've always had the same
>questions
>
>about the White Stag. Whether it's really Aslan, which is what I
>thought as
>
>a kid, or kind of an angelic being, or something else...of course, in
>
>Narnia, the line between angelic and "normal" is a bit blurry. You
>could
>
>easily argue that the river god and naiads are angelic in nature.
>
>
>
>Kristi the Fisherdess
>
>"There does not seem to be much chance of their meeting again in that
>world
>
>or any other. But if ever they do they will rush together with their
>hands
>
>held out." - The Voyage of the Dawn Treader
>
>
>
>
>
> >From: Daniel Himes <catwhowalksbyhimsel
>
> >Reply-To: thelionscall@
>
> >To: thelionscall@
>
> >Subject: Re: [thelionscall] New poll for thelionscall
>
> >Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2006 07:05:23 -0800 (PST)
>
> >
>
> >I'm pretty sure that Aslan doesn't appear until later. I really don't
>
> >think he's Aslan though. The bird in both book though, is describes as
>
>
> >being very watchful and aware.
>
> >
>
> >----- Original Message ----
>
> >From: "Stanley, Dan" <dstanley@ag.
>
> >To: thelionscall@
>
> >Sent: Thursday, November 30, 2006 9:08:22 AM
>
> >Subject: RE: [thelionscall] New poll for thelionscall
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
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> >
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> >
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> >
>
> >That's an excellent point Daniel. I
>
> >hadn't thought about that connection. That almost makes me assume
>
> >that the bird in the garden in MN
>
> >(Magician's Nephew, not
>
> >Minnesota), since (as Lewis knew) ancient Christians viewed the legend
>of
>
> >the
>
> >phoenix as a pre-Christian foreshadowing of Christ's death and
>
> >resurrection.
>
> >I don't have my Last Battle
>
> >here at the office to remind me, but is Aslan in the garden along with
>the
>
> >phoenix in that book? If he is, then that would put a small "kink in
>the
>
> >armor" of our Aslan/phoenix theory.
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >Blessings,
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >Dan
>
> >
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>
> >
>
> >From:
>
> >thelionscall@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:thelionscal l@yahoogroups. com]
>On
>
> >Behalf Of Daniel Himes
>
> >
>
> >Sent: Wednesday, November 29, 2006
>
> >5:21 PM
>
> >
>
> >To: thelionscall@ yahoogroups. com
>
> >
>
> >Subject: Re: [thelionscall] New
>
> >poll for thelionscall
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
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> >
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> >
>
> >
>
> >In The Last Battle, when
>
> >they are in the new Narnia, in the garden, the bird watching them is
>called
>
> >a
>
> >pheonix, which is what I always assumed the bird in this version of the
>
>
> >garden
>
> >was too, although beyond that, I cannot say.
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >----- Original Message
>
> >----
>
> >
>
> >From: "Stanley, Dan" <dstanley@ag. org>
>
> >
>
> >To: thelionscall@ yahoogroups. com
>
> >
>
> >Sent: Wednesday, November 29, 2006 2:51:01 PM
>
> >
>
> >Subject: RE: [thelionscall] New poll for thelionscall
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >Hello Kristi,
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >The bird watching Digory from the tree in the
>
> >center of the garden is a mystery to me. It may just be what it says:
>a
>
> >bird in the garden. The colors of its plumage could signify
>
> >Christological symbolism so that the bird could
>
> >be Aslan, but that would just be conjecture. I personally think it was
>
> >exactly what Digory thought: a reminder that you can never be too sure
>
> >who's
>
> >watching you in magical places like that.
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >Blessings,
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >Dan
>
> >
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>
> >
>
> >From: thelionscall@
>
> >yahoogroups. com [mailto:thelionscal l@yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of
>
> >Kristi Simonson
>
> >
>
> >Sent: Monday, November 27, 2006
>
> >1:25 PM
>
> >
>
> >To: thelionscall@ yahoogroups. com
>
> >
>
> >Subject: RE: [thelionscall] New
>
> >poll for thelionscall
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
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> >
>
> >I was
>
> >trying to remember that, too, Dan. Plus, wouldn't Digory/the
>
> >
>
> >Professor be the same? There are a few birds the come to mind in the
>book.
>
> >
>
> >The two ravens, who are asked to be part of the council, the Jackdaw,
>who
>
> >
>
> >was the first joke (maybe that's what was meant?) and the bird in the
>tree
>
> >
>
> >in the garden. BTW, what do you think that bird was? Aslan, a servant
>of
>
> >
>
> >Aslan?
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >Kristi
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >___________
>
> >
>
> >Get free, personalized commercial-free online radio with MSN Radio
>powered
>
> >
>
> >by Pandora http://radio.
>
> >msn.com/? icid=T002MSN03A0 7001
>
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RE: [thelionscall] Phoenixes, Stags and Aslan
I wasn't aware that a white stag had Christian significance. I know that
white animals are often a marker of passing into another world, such as
fairyland, and white deer in particular, in literature.
Kristi the Fisherdess
"There does not seem to be much chance of their meeting again in that world
or any other. But if ever they do they will rush together with their hands
held out." - The Voyage of the Dawn Treader
>From: "Stanley, Dan" <dstanley@ag.org>
>Reply-To: thelionscall@yahoogroups.com
>To: <thelionscall@yahoogroups.com>
>Subject: [thelionscall] Phoenixes, Stags and Aslan
>Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2006 11:01:34 -0600
>
>I have doubts that the white stag was Aslan in Lewis's mind. But
>thinking about that shifts my thinking a bit on the phoenix in the
>garden. The stag is an ancient Christological symbol as well (as John
>Granger emphasizes in his book on the hidden meanings of Harry Potter
>books). Perhaps Lewis just has a tendency to include these symbols in
>his story without them being actually symbolic of anything.
>
>
>
>Blessings,
>
>
>
>Dan
>
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: thelionscall@yahoogroups.com [mailto:thelionscall@yahoogroups.com]
>On Behalf Of Kristi Simonson
>Sent: Thursday, November 30, 2006 10:35 AM
>To: thelionscall@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: Re: [thelionscall] New poll for thelionscall
>
>
>
>Maybe more of an angelic figure then...I've always had the same
>questions
>
>about the White Stag. Whether it's really Aslan, which is what I
>thought as
>
>a kid, or kind of an angelic being, or something else...of course, in
>
>Narnia, the line between angelic and "normal" is a bit blurry. You
>could
>
>easily argue that the river god and naiads are angelic in nature.
>
>
>
>Kristi the Fisherdess
>
>"There does not seem to be much chance of their meeting again in that
>world
>
>or any other. But if ever they do they will rush together with their
>hands
>
>held out." - The Voyage of the Dawn Treader
>
>
>
>
>
> >From: Daniel Himes <catwhowalksbyhimself@yahoo.com>
>
> >Reply-To: thelionscall@yahoogroups.com
>
> >To: thelionscall@yahoogroups.com
>
> >Subject: Re: [thelionscall] New poll for thelionscall
>
> >Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2006 07:05:23 -0800 (PST)
>
> >
>
> >I'm pretty sure that Aslan doesn't appear until later. I really don't
>
> >think he's Aslan though. The bird in both book though, is describes as
>
>
> >being very watchful and aware.
>
> >
>
> >----- Original Message ----
>
> >From: "Stanley, Dan" <dstanley@ag.org>
>
> >To: thelionscall@yahoogroups.com
>
> >Sent: Thursday, November 30, 2006 9:08:22 AM
>
> >Subject: RE: [thelionscall] New poll for thelionscall
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >That's an excellent point Daniel. I
>
> >hadn't thought about that connection. That almost makes me assume
>
> >that the bird in the garden in MN
>
> >(Magician's Nephew, not
>
> >Minnesota), since (as Lewis knew) ancient Christians viewed the legend
>of
>
> >the
>
> >phoenix as a pre-Christian foreshadowing of Christ's death and
>
> >resurrection.
>
> >I don't have my Last Battle
>
> >here at the office to remind me, but is Aslan in the garden along with
>the
>
> >phoenix in that book? If he is, then that would put a small "kink in
>the
>
> >armor" of our Aslan/phoenix theory.
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >Blessings,
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >Dan
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >From:
>
> >thelionscall@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:thelionscal l@yahoogroups. com]
>On
>
> >Behalf Of Daniel Himes
>
> >
>
> >Sent: Wednesday, November 29, 2006
>
> >5:21 PM
>
> >
>
> >To: thelionscall@ yahoogroups. com
>
> >
>
> >Subject: Re: [thelionscall] New
>
> >poll for thelionscall
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >In The Last Battle, when
>
> >they are in the new Narnia, in the garden, the bird watching them is
>called
>
> >a
>
> >pheonix, which is what I always assumed the bird in this version of the
>
>
> >garden
>
> >was too, although beyond that, I cannot say.
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >----- Original Message
>
> >----
>
> >
>
> >From: "Stanley, Dan" <dstanley@ag. org>
>
> >
>
> >To: thelionscall@ yahoogroups. com
>
> >
>
> >Sent: Wednesday, November 29, 2006 2:51:01 PM
>
> >
>
> >Subject: RE: [thelionscall] New poll for thelionscall
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >Hello Kristi,
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >The bird watching Digory from the tree in the
>
> >center of the garden is a mystery to me. It may just be what it says:
>a
>
> >bird in the garden. The colors of its plumage could signify
>
> >Christological symbolism so that the bird could
>
> >be Aslan, but that would just be conjecture. I personally think it was
>
> >exactly what Digory thought: a reminder that you can never be too sure
>
> >who's
>
> >watching you in magical places like that.
>
> >
>
> >
>
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> >Blessings,
>
> >
>
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> >Dan
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> >From: thelionscall@
>
> >yahoogroups. com [mailto:thelionscal l@yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of
>
> >Kristi Simonson
>
> >
>
> >Sent: Monday, November 27, 2006
>
> >1:25 PM
>
> >
>
> >To: thelionscall@ yahoogroups. com
>
> >
>
> >Subject: RE: [thelionscall] New
>
> >poll for thelionscall
>
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> >I was
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> >trying to remember that, too, Dan. Plus, wouldn't Digory/the
>
> >
>
> >Professor be the same? There are a few birds the come to mind in the
>book.
>
> >
>
> >The two ravens, who are asked to be part of the council, the Jackdaw,
>who
>
> >
>
> >was the first joke (maybe that's what was meant?) and the bird in the
>tree
>
> >
>
> >in the garden. BTW, what do you think that bird was? Aslan, a servant
>of
>
> >
>
> >Aslan?
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >Kristi
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _
>
> >
>
> >Get free, personalized commercial-free online radio with MSN Radio
>powered
>
> >
>
> >by Pandora http://radio.
>
> >msn.com/? icid=T002MSN03A0 7001
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Re: [thelionscall] New poll for thelionscall
Maybe more of an angelic figure then...I've always had the same questions
about the White Stag. Whether it's really Aslan, which is what I thought as
a kid, or kind of an angelic being, or something else...of course, in
Narnia, the line between angelic and "normal" is a bit blurry. You could
easily argue that the river god and naiads are angelic in nature.
Kristi the Fisherdess
"There does not seem to be much chance of their meeting again in that world
or any other. But if ever they do they will rush together with their hands
held out." - The Voyage of the Dawn Treader
>From: Daniel Himes <catwhowalksbyhimself@yahoo.com>
>Reply-To: thelionscall@yahoogroups.com
>To: thelionscall@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: Re: [thelionscall] New poll for thelionscall
>Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2006 07:05:23 -0800 (PST)
>
>I'm pretty sure that Aslan doesn't appear until later. I really don't
>think he's Aslan though. The bird in both book though, is describes as
>being very watchful and aware.
>
>----- Original Message ----
>From: "Stanley, Dan" <dstanley@ag.org>
>To: thelionscall@yahoogroups.com
>Sent: Thursday, November 30, 2006 9:08:22 AM
>Subject: RE: [thelionscall] New poll for thelionscall
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>That�s an excellent point Daniel. I
>hadn�t thought about that connection. That almost makes me assume
>that the bird in the garden in MN
>(Magician�s Nephew, not
>Minnesota), since (as Lewis knew) ancient Christians viewed the legend of
>the
>phoenix as a pre-Christian foreshadowing of Christ�s death and
>resurrection.
>I don�t have my Last Battle
>here at the office to remind me, but is Aslan in the garden along with the
>phoenix in that book? If he is, then that would put a small �kink in the
>armor� of our Aslan/phoenix theory.
>
>
>
>
>
>Blessings,
>
>
>
>
>
>Dan
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>From:
>thelionscall@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:thelionscal l@yahoogroups. com] On
>Behalf Of Daniel Himes
>
>Sent: Wednesday, November 29, 2006
>5:21 PM
>
>To: thelionscall@ yahoogroups. com
>
>Subject: Re: [thelionscall] New
>poll for thelionscall
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>In The Last Battle, when
>they are in the new Narnia, in the garden, the bird watching them is called
>a
>pheonix, which is what I always assumed the bird in this version of the
>garden
>was too, although beyond that, I cannot say.
>
>
>
>
>----- Original Message
>----
>
>From: "Stanley, Dan" <dstanley@ag. org>
>
>To: thelionscall@ yahoogroups. com
>
>Sent: Wednesday, November 29, 2006 2:51:01 PM
>
>Subject: RE: [thelionscall] New poll for thelionscall
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Hello Kristi,
>
>
>
>
>
>The bird watching Digory from the tree in the
>center of the garden is a mystery to me. It may just be what it says: a
>bird in the garden. The colors of its plumage could signify
>Christological symbolism so that the bird could
>be Aslan, but that would just be conjecture. I personally think it was
>exactly what Digory thought: a reminder that you can never be too sure
>who�s
>watching you in magical places like that.
>
>
>
>
>
>Blessings,
>
>
>
>
>
>Dan
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>From: thelionscall@
>yahoogroups. com [mailto:thelionscal l@yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of
>Kristi Simonson
>
>Sent: Monday, November 27, 2006
>1:25 PM
>
>To: thelionscall@ yahoogroups. com
>
>Subject: RE: [thelionscall] New
>poll for thelionscall
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>I was
>trying to remember that, too, Dan. Plus, wouldn't Digory/the
>
>Professor be the same? There are a few birds the come to mind in the book.
>
>The two ravens, who are asked to be part of the council, the Jackdaw, who
>
>was the first joke (maybe that's what was meant?) and the bird in the tree
>
>in the garden. BTW, what do you think that bird was? Aslan, a servant of
>
>Aslan?
>
>
>
>Kristi
>
>
>
>____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _
>
>Get free, personalized commercial-free online radio with MSN Radio powered
>
>by Pandora http://radio.
>msn.com/? icid=T002MSN03A0 7001
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RE: [thelionscall] New poll for thelionscall
Oh, speaking of the White Stag, he made an amuzing appearance in one of the
honorable mentions of the last Writing Contest on The Lion's Call (The
challenge was to write a beauty makeover for a Narnian character.):
IT'S NOT REALLY ME by ILuvLucy
-I don't thimk I can do this!
-of course you can! it's just a couple of highlights!
-but I just don't think it's me.
-what are you talking about. with your complection it will look wonderful!
-I still don't know. I don't thik people will recongnize me if I get all
these highlights.
-exactly! do you really want to spend the rest of your life running from
people?
-it's not my fault, it's passed down in my family.
-and now you can change that.
-I just don't think if I get highlights I'll still feel like the WHITE stag!
You can see the other winners at
http://www.thelionscall.com/humor/assignment.cfm
Kristi the Fisherdess
"There does not seem to be much chance of their meeting again in that world
or any other. But if ever they do they will rush together with their hands
held out." - The Voyage of the Dawn Treader
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